I think what Sebastian was referring to was when a dealer buys a car from someone and leaves out information when they go to re-sell it. Like that yellow car that was on EBAY a few months ago where someone pulled up the original craigslist listing where the seller said he had not run the engine since it bent a valve. The new seller omitted this information.

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My wife and I recently sold a car, sight unseen, to Gullwing Motor Sports. The gentleman who we dealt with wired the money without first receiving the title so there was a level of trust between us. They were also professional when picking up the car so overall it was a pleasant experience.

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I was just looking at the ad in our classified for the yellow car. I would be shocked if ALL of the valves were not bent! The market will find a price for that car. It has air conditioning and a radio and a real Porsche engine and transmission and steering wheel. I think it is crap but that should not catch the buyer unaware.

About 4 years ago a friend of a friend bought a C Cab from a VERY well known west coast dealer. He was a late model Porsche owner and really did not know what he was purchasing. He wanted a car and not an adventure of visiting a bunch private sellers all over the country. He did his own inspection of the car when he bought it. When it arrived to his PA home he started to enjoy it and showed it to some of the local faithful. This put the local experts in an uncomfortable position because other than shiny paint the car was garbage. Then, within a month the engine blew up. All the experts were sad for this guy because they felt that he was so upside down and he was not happy with the extra expense.

Fast forward to a few months ago. The C Cab owner was tired of the car and wanted a more modern Porsche. He called the "reputable" dealer to find out what they thought he should ask for his 356. That dealer offered him much more than he expected to get for the car, much more than he had invested, and the dealer had a modern Porsche that fit his requirements. A deal was done. The fairytale ends happily ever after. As far as I am concerned, I would never send a friend to that dealer just because they did nothing about the engine. I would be very wary of buying a car there and would never rely on the dealer to tell me about what is wrong with the car.

The question is which car is more honest? The yellow T-5 at Gullwing or the C Cab at the well known purveyor of fine rust free west coast cars? If you buy a bad car you should blame yourself unless there is fraud like changing the good parts for crap parts in the time between your inspection and when the car is delivered or if the paperwork is faked or if some very slick repairs were made that have no chance of holding up.

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Cliff Murray

 

'55 Cabriolet Racer

'57 Speedster

'59 Sunroof

'63 Coupe Pushrod GS 2133

'67 911 S

Wrong yellow car Cliff.

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Look again. Kumar....Gullwing

http://porsche356registry.org/classifie ... 27&catid=1

I don't know of a different one.

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Cliff Murray

 

'55 Cabriolet Racer

'57 Speedster

'59 Sunroof

'63 Coupe Pushrod GS 2133

'67 911 S

This was the car that was discussed a couple of months ago, not the shark car that Peter has.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Porsche- ... 33651d18f8

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My personal commentary:

Who ever C2CONVERT is, asked for an opinion on Gullwing Motors of New York.

Several posters offered their experience on Gullwing Motors. That is what C2CONVERT asked for. So, his question is answered.

On this forum, we all try and play nice with each other. Sometimes, too nice and we don't get warned when a bad deal is about to happen. Not to say that the deal with Gullwing Motors is bad.

We should all be allowed to express our opinions without being questioned as long as it is the truth.

If we should openly discuss these issues. This is not about whether someone is allowed to make a profit or Economics 101, this is about being open and honest. Whether they make a profit , who cares? Get back to the germaine issue of the trust worthiness of this vendor/seller and what are everyone's experiences with them.

If we could not discuss openly these issues, we would not spend as much bandwidth on guys like Wayne Krieger and his dealings and then we would all be in a pickle.

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100% correct!

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Cliff Murray

 

'55 Cabriolet Racer

'57 Speedster

'59 Sunroof

'63 Coupe Pushrod GS 2133

'67 911 S

Hi Cliff,

Thanks again for your response. I may have not explained it very well in my original post. If you still do not understand what my point is after this response than I can only hope we meet in person one day at a 356 event so you can see that my intentions were nothing but good to the OP. As far as the dealer goes, I am sure you have read others' posts about their reputation




Thanks again for listening Cliff.

Regards,

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Sebastian Gaeta
Registry #8339
'65 C coupe
'64 C cab

Hi, John Lok (c2convert),

You're probably in a fog here from all the to-ing and fro-ing that your request has raised.

I will make it simple for you: I don't care how reputable or disreputable the dealer is. As a potential buyer, you will be an idiot if you buy this or any other 356 sight unseen without first getting a PPI on the car from a local 356 expert. This will be the best $200 that you will every spend, peanuts, really, when you come down to the tens of thousands of dollars for a 356.

Believe me, there are 356 experts in every corner of the country, and the area around Gullwing Motors is no exception. I would do the same for any prominent dealer in California or elsewhere. A dealer is not in business to represent your interests, he is in business to represent his own interests. That is why most of these cars are sold "as is" and "no warranty" implied or offered. Caveat emptor...

At a minimum, if you didn't like the car AND they agreed to take it back, you would be out thousands of dollars in shipping and insurance charges, so another argument in favor of a PPI.

Finally, never be in a rush to buy any 356. That's the dealer's job, to close the sale. It's your responsibility to decide whether doing so is in your best interests. Remember that there will always be another 356 for sale around the corner.

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I sold a car last year to Peter Kumar of Gullwing Motors.
The car was a rough looking SC coupe. I advertised it here and some of you may have seen it. I received a call from Mr. Kumar very soon after placing my ad.
He indicated that he owned a restoration shop and wanted to fully restore the car. That sat well with me as I like these cars and felt the car deserved a nice restoration. He offered a low price and argued long and hard that his offer was the market value and all the car was worth. I finally agreed to a negotiated price.
The sale went very smoothly and quickly. The money was wire transferred that day and I FedEx'd the title. A transporter arrived and hauled the car away. I recevied no follow up comments on the car from Mr. Kumar. The car appeared on Samba the next week for $5k more than I sold it for.
The good of this was that there were no hasstles at all and everything related to the sale went very smoothly.
Would I sell another car to Gullwing. No.
I felt that person would have said anything to try to better the price.
I can only imagine the same holds true on the sell side.
Be Careful out there.
Dan

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"I never leave Ann Arbor. The real world is too hard to face."

What I am reading here is that Kumar is out to make a quick buck flipping inventory without any added value other than the company name and connections. Nothing inherently wrong with that, but it would make me a little uncomfortable dealing with them on the sell side, perhaps less so on the buy side if you have done your PPI homework.

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Carl wrote: "A dealer is not in business to represent your interests, he is in business to represent his own interests"

Carl

I have to disagree with that statement. Any reputable dealer/business person better have his customer's interests in mind or he won't last for very long. It may not be true for "dealers" that depend on the internet for their livelyhood, though. A good reputation is a very valuable thing and takes more than just hard work to maintain.

Regards

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Really?

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Cliff Murray

 

'55 Cabriolet Racer

'57 Speedster

'59 Sunroof

'63 Coupe Pushrod GS 2133

'67 911 S

"A dealer is not in business to represent your interests, he is in business to represent his own interests."

That's a CROCK!

If a dealer doesn't have his customers' interests in mind, he won't last very long!

CW

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Charlie White